Hi,
I am currently in the process of leaving cogwa and i am quite happy to have found your site. I am gathering factual evidence to refute the false claims that WCG (& COG offshoots) are the true church.
What has caught my attention is a paragraph in the the ambassador report.
http://hwarmstrong.com/ar/AR33.html
William T. Voyce’s June 3, 1985 letter to the Worldwide Church of God is a veritable research paper with a “point-by-point refutation of their interpretation of American Sabbath history.” Mr. Voyce is a member of the Church of God, 7th Day and wrote the 7-page letter to the WCG after reading their article “The Church They Couldn’t Destroy.”Mr. Voyce has not received a WCG reply to his letter, the subject of which he feels is so important that “if the truth about this matter were more widely known, a good share of the Worldwide Church’s membership would never have joined in the first place.” Copies of this interesting letter are available for $1 by writing: William T. Voyce, 140 SouthHickory, Des Moines, Iowa 50317.
I have found out that William died in 2007 so I am wondering if the current or old PT editors (Douglas Becker maybe) might have a copy of this letter that I may obtain.
I sincerely appreciate your assistance in the request so I may carry on my search for information against all these false claims.
Alex
This was re-posted from the ‘About’ page.
Anyone have a copy of this for Alex?
I have never seen this particular paper, however, there are numerous resources currently available on the internet treating any number of the traditional doctrines of Armstrongism. It is surprising what comes up just by Googling “sabbath”. The reader must do his or her own due diligence, because the quality of the research varies widely. Any and all information is also constantly subject to challenge or debate, some of the challenges being based on sectarian bias. There are some areas of belief in which a person must realize that the best he can do is reach a certain standard of “reasonable doubt” because it is impossible to reach a 100% iron clad conclusion.
I left WCG in 1975 when the original endtimes prophecy timeline which the church had been taught failed. Of course the church attempted to backpedal, and to say that they had never set dates, but we had been taught three mathematic equations supporting a 1975 end in our Ambassador College Bible classes, meaning that the backpedaling and excuses perpetrated by the church were lies. At the time I left, John Trechak, the editor of Ambassador Reports, was a personal friend of mine, and he provided information to me refuting many of the doctrines. Much of that material had come from Dr. Ernest Martin, whose son Samuel has preserved many of his father’s archives.
After decades out of Armstrongism, I was satisfied with my decisions regarding the church at the time I signed on to the internet approximately 15 years ago. When I looked for some of my friends from the church, I found that some of them were active on this site, and that there were also numerous blogs and forums where former and present members conducted discussions to assist them in processing our mutual experiences. In these discussions, many resources surfaced just as a by-product of normal discussion. I found that investigating these as they came up contributed to the security of my 1975 decision that WCG, and Armstrongism, were a false system. Therefore, I would suggest that you get involved in some of the blogs listed on this site. Some provide the perspectives of believers, while others present the views of atheists or agnostics. Much of the material overlaps, and is claimed by both sides. It’s up to each of us to do our own research, and to make our own decisions. This is a marked departure from Armstrongism, a movement which demanded that we single-source our information, and allow the church to make the most important decisions in our lives.
In your travels, you may see things which either challenge or offend you. I’d suggest toughing it out, sloshing through what might strike you as being garbage to get to the nuggets. The nuggets are there, and the search is worthwhile. Some of the key elements are easily dispatched with, such as British Israelism, and the so-called “True History of the True Church”. Reading surrviving documents from the first centuries such as the works of Josephus and the writings of the Antenicene Fathers will also be helpful, if you have the disposable time to invest. Good luck in your journey! Life is about to get much better.
BB
Sorry Bob that your comment was delayed. It got marked as spam, but don’t feel bad, sometimes mine do also!
I’d buy that for a dollar! (to quote a catchphrase from RoboCop)
It would be interesting to see if there was any yet unpublished research.
The interest is not on the Sabbath per se, but the sloppy scholarship, plagiarism and improbable history that went into to WCG’s dogma regarding church history.
Douglas Becker who has taken and converted our book ‘Daughter Of Babylon’ to a book format on his site:
http://ambassadorreports.com/DaughterofBabylon/assets/basic-html/page57.html
I suggest you read the entire chapter.
We read:
There have been others who wanted to know if per chance they had read the wrong books when
looking for the Church of God lineage in historical sources cited by Worldwide Church of God
publications. For example, in 1991, Mr. Gene Bailey of Nicholasville, Kentucky wrote a four page
letter to evangelist Ronald Kelly at Worldwide Church of God headquarters:
…
I am enclosing many copies of pages so you can see where my questions come from. I have been
reading your information in the Plain Truth about the “History of the Church of God.” Also I have been
studying the booklets “A True History of the True Church” and “The Church They Couldn’t Destroy”….
…
I have not been able to find any evidence that William Miller ever became a Sabbath keeper. If you
have information about this, please place it here….On page 23 (Cox’s Sabbath Literature, Vol. 1, p.
162.
Enclosed is the page from what I think is that book, please mark on that page where that
information in that paragraph is taken from what and where it is, I don’t see it…Please let me know
here where I can find this information. On the next page…Please explain on this page what is meant
out of this paragraph…At this point please mark what state, city, where this church was located so I
can do additional research on it to see if it also was involved in the Millerite movement and if it was a
Sunday or Sabbath keeping church…please review and elaborate here…please at this place explain…at
this place, let me know where I can locate this information…I haven’t found any information that the
name “Church of God” was given to any church which you mentioned coming before the Worldwide
Church of God, The Church of God (Seventh Day), and the Seventh Day Baptists from about 1673-
1875….
should one then say the above churches from 1673 to 1875 were counterfeit and could not have
been part of the Church of God at anytime? Also, can anything that is counterfeit ever become the real
true thing?…
Mr. Bailey informed me over the phone in 1993 that he had still not received a response from the
Worldwide Church of God or Ron Kelly to his 1991 letter.
And so ends our investigation into what Worldwide Church of God authors have entitled the “True
History of the one true church of God” from the New Testament to the 19th century. Up to this point it
has been more or less pulled out of thin air, falsified and fabricated–frustrating those who have tried to
verify their sources.
I recommend first, “History of the Church of God Seventh Day” by Ken Durham at http://ambassadorreports.com/ first, since that’s free. If you want to check origins further, “The Journey: A History of the Church of God Seventh Day” by Robert Coulter is informative, particularly Chapter 23 where he rips Herbert Wolf Armstrong a new one basically calling him a liar.
The “A True History of a True Church” came from Dugger and Dodd who plagiarized it from Ellen G. White’s “The Great Controversy”. You may note the reference to the Waldensians being Sabbath keepers (a total myth — according to the Waldensians themselves) in White’s book. Note that she plagiarized it from somewhere, but where is not clear.
You may also look at “The Spectacular Failure of British Israelism” over at http://britishisraelism.com/ and if that doesn’t convince you that the whole thing is nuts, you’re missing something.
The Ken Durham thesis and the Robert Coulter book do a great deal of damage to the claims that the WCG came through a long line of ‘Apostles’ from the first century originals. The Church of God Seventh Day admits that it really comes from the efforts of Ellen and James White during the time they began the Seventh Day Adventists in the 19th Century. And it’s true: William Miller never was a Sabbath keeper. Moreover, the CoG7D which was the source of Herbert Wolf Armstrong’s base eschatology never were connected with the earlier Seventh Day Baptists (mostly begun by the weird nut, John Trask).
Of course, there’s a much easier and quicker way to establish that the Cult of Herbert Armstrong Mafia is illegitimate: False prophecy based on British Israelism, the so-called key to Prophecy. Herbert Armstrong got it wrong (predicting the United States and Britain would lose World War II in 1943 was not a promising beginning) and by the time we get to “1975 in Prophecy) (which you can also find at http://ambassadorreports.com/), you can see how absolutely pathetic the entire CoHAM is. Check out what he says about Tito being the Beast. Nothing he predicted came to pass in his life time, and if you don’t believe that he was a false prophet, check out his coworker letters he signed “In Jesus’ Name” where he makes Christ the backer of his illegitimate kook ideas.
The question is, what are you attempting to do? If you are trying to prove that the WCG is not legitimate for yourself, that is one thing — and you have your answer in spades.
If, on the other hand, you are trying to convince someone else, good luck with that. Ambassador College so corrupted those in the CoHAM that they have gone mental and like so many mentally ill patients, they don’t see their sickness for what it is. In fact, they make every attempt to convince YOU that YOU are the one who needs help. Once in this mind-controlling abusive cult of evil, people just don’t leave. Witness CoG-PKG, where their cultmeister poobah is in Federal Prison after being convicted of five counts of felony fraud for Income Tax Evasion — and this after the spectacular failure of his prophecies. People stay in his sub micro cult and are convinced that it is persecution, not prosecution.
I say it’s indolence and hubris. The people are proud that they are ‘special’ and they are too lazy to look into it. I see this all the time. The latest is a man who was baptized into the CoG7D and then hied off to the Church of God The Eternal to be baptized again. This is the insane little group that believes in the original divorce and remarriage doctrines and keeps Pentecost on Monday… still. They are firmly ensconced in British Israelism. You know, they even lock the doors as services begin so no one can get in they haven’t previously interviewed and approved. It isn’t as if this man wasn’t forewarned: He really knew better but joined the group anyway because it gives him something — something no other cult he’s found offers him.
So don’t bother to look for proof to get someone else out — it’s counter productive: The harder you try the more resistant they become.
Yes, we do post here in hopes that someone still has some snippet of rationality left and aren’t too lazy (or proud) to look into the facts. Sometimes, in rare cases it works. People leave and have peace from reduced mental noise.
But mostly, the majority cling to their depressive obsession looking for the whole thing to end so they can be relieved from their miser of accomplishing nothing and being no one.
A lot of resources get shared in normal conversation on most of these forums and blogs. I would recommend further sharing and participation, investigating the leads which are throw out to the readers from time to time.
Seems, Alex, like you already have the most important ingredient, which is an open mind. He ones with the closed minds are the ones who shut out information soley because it disagrees with what was taught by HWA.
Awesome Gentlemen!
thank you all for the information & assistance, I’ll no doubt get a copy of Robert Coulter’s book to read as well.
I must admit, this is not for me as I am already convinced, I’m just gathering all the evidence required to present it at the showdown with my minister – I know he won’t accept it, however I owe it to myself to have the knowledge behind my decision. I assume this will be one of many areas that will be covered as he’ll no doubt claim they have the authority & truth due to these false historical claims, I therefore need to refute it with facts.
If I ever track down the letter, I’ll be more than happy to pass it on to you all.
Going to an Armstrongist minister with absolute proof his religion is wrong is like trying to teach a boar to sing opera.
I did advise one person who had David Pack in his home for 24 hours running down his wife and being extremely abusive about it to do as it suggests in “Take Back Your Life”: Write a letter to Pack to with the facts about who and what he is. The man informed me that he wasn’t going to do it because of “powerful evil spiritual forces” which might cause him trouble after he came to their attention. It’s an interesting method of avoidance. It’s been years and he’s still stuck in constant angst from the event. It just seems to me that taking the advice is better than stewing in it for years and years and years. Part of the advantage of these blogs is to have the freedom to tell ministers just who and what they are and the impact they have had so people can move past them (or better yet, trample them and leave them behind).
The main cheery thought is that sooner or later they will die and that will be that.
Be careful that the minister-pig does not turn and rend you.
Excellent advice Mr. Becker!
More on Ernest Martin can be found here:
http://www.askelm.com/resources/qryutiln.asp
Will keep you posted…
Big fan of Dr Ernest Martin, he’s got a great paper on the 7 churches of Rev. which explains how they have nothing to do with 7 eras throughout history.
http://www.askelm.com/prophecy/p070901.htm
The eras of the church are designed to make the people feel ‘special’
It is this ‘elite’ emotion that keeps people tied to the movement and the money flowing to their handlers.